(Paul Kaufman of Manual Scan and Lemons Are Yellow reflects on the decline of empires.)
My favorite albums were always those that weren’t just a collection of songs but presented a unified picture of their time and place, a map to their own little world. Coming of musical age in the late ’70s, one notable example was the first Clash LP, which presented a rich portrait of London as a decayed and violent landscape where one struggled for survival. This echoed the theme of how the lost power and fortune of the British empire diminished the expectations of its current citizens; this was presented by many bands, from the Kinks to the Jam.
These were distant but clever and interesting voices, and very different from the “Morning in America” world view that pervaded the US in the ’80s. They seemed especially far from San Diego, where the nearly perpetual sunshine provides a completely different backdrop from London’s rain.
Of course, as a teen, all those records gave me a sharp case of London envy, even though I wouldn’t actually set foot there for many years to come. The music! The history! The distinct neighborhoods! The culture! Obviously, I wasn’t alone in this, as both the punk and mod scenes were at least initially influenced by vinyl from across the sea.
But I wondered how well some things would translate, given that as sunny Americans, we had not had to take shelter and prepare for invasion, nor watch our future slide downhill with the economy. Simplistically, part of me thought: did the decay and hopelessness rampant in postwar England help to develop the deep and rich music that exploded in the ’60s?
So, I’m thinking we may have the chance to find out. As America circles the drain in this decade, having squandered its economic future and all its prestige, with its educational and health-care systems the envy of no one, we’re poised. Perhaps the next great heir to Ray Davies will come from the US, a land of newly diminished expectations.
What do you think? What locale was mythical to you when you were young? And where do you think we’re going?
— Paul Kaufman
Paul, an amazingly great subject! Let’s go back through the economic history of the 20th century to find the music and art scenes that went with them (here’s a shot):
Great Depression: Lost Generation (remember “The Sun Also Rises”?)
The Post War Era: The Beat Generation and bebop
The Post War Recovery: “Swinging” London
Britain’s ’70s Economic Depression: Punk Rock
My favorite scene from “On the Road” is that part where they pull into Chicago after drifting across the nation with all these hobos, and Kerouac goes -- bebop was just happening and Miles was everywhere…
So, my prediction is that a rock and roll messiah will rise up in the East (or anyway… maybe East Africa), and return to American to usher in the rock and roll judgement day. Fire and brimstone! Woe to you that have strayed from the one true path for thou shalt be cast into MOR purgatory with Justin Timberlake.
Paul, an amazingly great subject! Let’s go back through the economic history of the 20th century to find the music and art scenes that went with them (here’s a shot):
Great Depression: Lost Generation (remember “The Sun Also Rises”?)
The Post War Era: The Beat Generation and bebop
The Post War Recovery: “Swinging” London
Britain’s ’70s Economic Depression: Punk Rock
My favorite scene from “On the Road” is that part where they pull into Chicago after drifting across the nation with all these hobos, and Kerouac goes -- bebop was just happening and Miles was everywhere…
So, my prediction is that a rock and roll messiah will rise up in the East (or anyway… maybe East Africa), and return to American to usher in the rock and roll judgement day. Fire and brimstone! Woe to you that have strayed from the one true path for thou shalt be cast into MOR purgatory with Justin Timberlake.
Yes! A rock ‘n’ roll messiah from East Africa! I know of just the guy 😉
Good analogies, Dave. But one small thing- Sun Also Rises was written by Hemingway in 1926, so that reflects the dissolution after the First World War, which gave birth to a huge number of artistic movements, many coming out of Gertrude Stein’s living room…
I think of Great Depression as fostering Steinbeck on the literary side (Grapes of Wrath) and Woody Guthrie on the populist musical side… putting in place a musical heritage for the young Bob Dylan decades later.
……
In one of Tom Ward’s posts, he mentioned the fab British documentary series 28/35/42/49… UP, which revisits the same set of people every 7 years, having started at age 7. The resounding theme is how much of life for most of these Britons was strongly influenced by their socio-economic status at birth, quite a different message from the “American Dream” of social mobility. The biggest counter-example in that series was also telling: the bright boy from a very small rural village in Yorkshire who goes on to become a physicist. He moves to the US when there are no job opportunities in the UK.
Have we swapped places??
right now the U.K. and the U.S. are in real trouble, the whole world economics are kinda up in the air, due to bad bundled loans sold to the world market.
Looks like some peoples greed might bite us all in the ass.
When or if the shit hits the fan it will it will be interesting to see what happens in art, music and Literature. Art in general needs a swift kick in the ass if you ask me, but having my son grow up in a depression is a high price to pay for Cultural Revolution.
War, depression maybe we will see the rise of something like a new Dada movment in america or world wide….or just maybe the return of good Rock & Roll music.
right now the U.K. and the U.S. are in real trouble, the whole world economics are kinda up in the air, due to bad bundled loans sold to the world market.
Looks like some peoples greed might bite us all in the ass.
When or if the shit hits the fan it will it will be interesting to see what happens in art, music and Literature. Art in general needs a swift kick in the ass if you ask me, but having my son grow up in a depression is a high price to pay for Cultural Revolution.
War, depression maybe we will see the rise of something like a new Dada movment in america or world wide….or just maybe the return of good Rock & Roll music.
I like your reference to Dada Dylan! The way I see it is the situation the US finds itself in today was inevitable. It is all part of the globalization of business and investments. As always the US is slow to wake up from its slumber.
I actually feel that this is a good thing. As soon as we, Americans, accept the fact that we are not the top of the world financial food chain but just a large blip on a parallel line of nations, we can take our proper place on the world stage. Politically, militarily, socially and culturally. As far as art & music goes times of trouble can only stimulate it.
I like your reference to Dada Dylan! The way I see it is the situation the US finds itself in today was inevitable. It is all part of the globalization of business and investments. As always the US is slow to wake up from its slumber.
I actually feel that this is a good thing. As soon as we, Americans, accept the fact that we are not the top of the world financial food chain but just a large blip on a parallel line of nations, we can take our proper place on the world stage. Politically, militarily, socially and culturally. As far as art & music goes times of trouble can only stimulate it.
>>When or if the shit hits the fan it will it will be interesting to see what happens in art, music and Literature.
Dylan -- a keen insight.
I hope we are blasted out of the materially obsessed culture that has produced the manufactured “American Idol” music of today. Culture has become a lot of plastic fantastic fluff. I’m not surprised by the recent market crunch. When people base their reality on imaginary money, the illusion is bound to go up in smoke. The result is raw -- punk rock!
We need to lose in order to gain our humanity back.
>>When or if the shit hits the fan it will it will be interesting to see what happens in art, music and Literature.
Dylan -- a keen insight.
I hope we are blasted out of the materially obsessed culture that has produced the manufactured “American Idol” music of today. Culture has become a lot of plastic fantastic fluff. I’m not surprised by the recent market crunch. When people base their reality on imaginary money, the illusion is bound to go up in smoke. The result is raw -- punk rock!
We need to lose in order to gain our humanity back.
Oh -and Paul -- loved your post! What a cool topic.
The mythical locale of my youth was middle earth. 🙂
Oh -and Paul -- loved your post! What a cool topic.
The mythical locale of my youth was middle earth. 🙂
Kristen- you’re in good company:
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/SHOWBIZ/Movies/03/28/rings.beatles/
“John Lennon wanted to play the grasping, thieving creature Gollum in a 1960s Beatles version of the “Lord of the Rings,” New Zealand movie director Peter Jackson told Wellington’s Evening Post newspaper.”
Kristen- you’re in good company:
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/SHOWBIZ/Movies/03/28/rings.beatles/
“John Lennon wanted to play the grasping, thieving creature Gollum in a 1960s Beatles version of the “Lord of the Rings,” New Zealand movie director Peter Jackson told Wellington’s Evening Post newspaper.”
Paul Kaufman; Hmmmm … Love me some Beatles, but “Beatles’ Lord of the Rings” sounds like it would make “Magical Mystery Tour” look like “Citizen Kane.”
Paul Kaufman; Hmmmm … Love me some Beatles, but “Beatles’ Lord of the Rings” sounds like it would make “Magical Mystery Tour” look like “Citizen Kane.”
times are rough but times have always been. i was in dallas over the weekend and i had a real good time. i had some homegrown and a trunk full of tecate on ice so i went and visited lee harvey’s grave, i left him a cold beer and popped on over to the fort worth stockyards which was cool as hell and not touristy lame at all, especially if you like cowboy shit and who doesn’t like cowboy shit? later on i bought this record called nancy and lee again, the not so well known 1972 follow up to 1968s world famous nancy and lee, well let me tell you it’s bad ass! a fitting soundtrack to the times we’re in and going to be in, check out a tune on it called down from dover and you’ll hear what i mean. so yeah what are you going to do? i suggest head to dollar general, buy a 99 cent t-shirt that says “get your money up” on the front of it, get high, get loaded, listen to nancy and lee again and ride it out.
times are rough but times have always been. i was in dallas over the weekend and i had a real good time. i had some homegrown and a trunk full of tecate on ice so i went and visited lee harvey’s grave, i left him a cold beer and popped on over to the fort worth stockyards which was cool as hell and not touristy lame at all, especially if you like cowboy shit and who doesn’t like cowboy shit? later on i bought this record called nancy and lee again, the not so well known 1972 follow up to 1968s world famous nancy and lee, well let me tell you it’s bad ass! a fitting soundtrack to the times we’re in and going to be in, check out a tune on it called down from dover and you’ll hear what i mean. so yeah what are you going to do? i suggest head to dollar general, buy a 99 cent t-shirt that says “get your money up” on the front of it, get high, get loaded, listen to nancy and lee again and ride it out.
Matthew- “Hmmmm … Love me some Beatles, but “Beatles’ Lord of the Rings” sounds like it would make “Magical Mystery Tour” look like “Citizen Kane.””
And think of all the great moments the accompanying album would have had….
“Picture yourself in your house in the Shire…”
Matthew- “Hmmmm … Love me some Beatles, but “Beatles’ Lord of the Rings” sounds like it would make “Magical Mystery Tour” look like “Citizen Kane.””
And think of all the great moments the accompanying album would have had….
“Picture yourself in your house in the Shire…”
Watching McCartney Frodo-ing around for 90 minutes would be way too much. Twenty-three-year-old George Harrison would be ridiculous as Gandalf. Lennon doing Gollum could be fun for a short film. (I liked him in “How I Won the War.”) Did they even get around to casting Ringo??
Watching McCartney Frodo-ing around for 90 minutes would be way too much. Twenty-three-year-old George Harrison would be ridiculous as Gandalf. Lennon doing Gollum could be fun for a short film. (I liked him in “How I Won the War.”) Did they even get around to casting Ringo??
It says in the article that Ringo would be cast as Frodo’s sidekick Sam. Who would be Saruman? Yoko!
It says in the article that Ringo would be cast as Frodo’s sidekick Sam. Who would be Saruman? Yoko!
>>Who would be Saruman? Yoko!
Kristen: I was assuming George Martin. Or Murray the K.
>>times are rough but times have always been.
BOogie: Wow … There’s actually a whole lotta truth in that formulation. I keep repeating it to myself, and I think it’s going to be a bit of a mantra.
>>Who would be Saruman? Yoko!
Kristen: I was assuming George Martin. Or Murray the K.
>>times are rough but times have always been.
BOogie: Wow … There’s actually a whole lotta truth in that formulation. I keep repeating it to myself, and I think it’s going to be a bit of a mantra.
Same as it ever was, my friends…
This is a public service announcement
With guitar
Know your rights all three of them
Number 1
You have the right not to be killed
Murder is a crime!
Unless it was done by a
Policeman or aristocrat
Know your rights
And number 2
You have the right to food money
Providing of course you
Dont mind a little
Investigation, humiliation
And if you cross your fingers
Rehabilitation
Know your rights
These are your rights
Wang
Know these rights
Number 3
You have the right to free
Speech as long as youre not
Dumb enough to actually try it.
Know your rights
These are your rights
All three of em
It has been suggested
In some quarters that this is not enough!
Well…………………………
Get off the streets
Get off the streets
Run
You dont have a home to go to
Smush
Finally then I will read you your rights
You have the right to remain silent
You are warned that anything you say
Can and will be taken down
And used as evidence against you
Listen to this
Run
Same as it ever was, my friends…
This is a public service announcement
With guitar
Know your rights all three of them
Number 1
You have the right not to be killed
Murder is a crime!
Unless it was done by a
Policeman or aristocrat
Know your rights
And number 2
You have the right to food money
Providing of course you
Dont mind a little
Investigation, humiliation
And if you cross your fingers
Rehabilitation
Know your rights
These are your rights
Wang
Know these rights
Number 3
You have the right to free
Speech as long as youre not
Dumb enough to actually try it.
Know your rights
These are your rights
All three of em
It has been suggested
In some quarters that this is not enough!
Well…………………………
Get off the streets
Get off the streets
Run
You dont have a home to go to
Smush
Finally then I will read you your rights
You have the right to remain silent
You are warned that anything you say
Can and will be taken down
And used as evidence against you
Listen to this
Run
Okay. I call bs on the Beatles-LOTR film. The source is a CNN Entertainment webpage, and their only source is Peter Jackson, who has been known to pull a few legs.
Okay. I call bs on the Beatles-LOTR film. The source is a CNN Entertainment webpage, and their only source is Peter Jackson, who has been known to pull a few legs.
Whoa….this is feeling too close to the eighties, being stuck in a smoked filled room for 36 hours thinking that we knew it all…but hey we were young and we did. Getting a little too deep now kids….so how are those??? Padres? Chargers?
Whoa….this is feeling too close to the eighties, being stuck in a smoked filled room for 36 hours thinking that we knew it all…but hey we were young and we did. Getting a little too deep now kids….so how are those??? Padres? Chargers?
Another unverifiable source:
http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Beatles :
“… Twiggy was apparently to be Galadriel. ”
Internet froth? Perhaps we’ll never know. But fun to think about.
Oh, and the Padres? Beautiful new stadium, right downtown, part of the Gaslamp renovation that rode many old haunts like Funland out of town, as documented better by others on these pages…
Another unverifiable source:
http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/The_Beatles :
“… Twiggy was apparently to be Galadriel. ”
Internet froth? Perhaps we’ll never know. But fun to think about.
Oh, and the Padres? Beautiful new stadium, right downtown, part of the Gaslamp renovation that rode many old haunts like Funland out of town, as documented better by others on these pages…
>>Okay. I call bs on the Beatles-LOTR film.
Ray: Let’s not forget that these were the same guys who gave all that money to Magic Alex. “Mardas later asked for the V-12 engines from Lennon’s Rolls-Royce and Harrison’s Ferrari cars, so he could build a Flying saucer.”
>>Okay. I call bs on the Beatles-LOTR film.
Ray: Let’s not forget that these were the same guys who gave all that money to Magic Alex. “Mardas later asked for the V-12 engines from Lennon’s Rolls-Royce and Harrison’s Ferrari cars, so he could build a Flying saucer.”
I’m with Boogie , it should be all about Lee and Nancy.That TV special from 67′” Movin’ With Nancy”; Dino ,Desi & Billy R.C.”Royal Crown” cola commercial Wow!! Dean M. , Frank , maybe Nelson Riddle , frank Jr.
I’m with Boogie , it should be all about Lee and Nancy.That TV special from 67′” Movin’ With Nancy”; Dino ,Desi & Billy R.C.”Royal Crown” cola commercial Wow!! Dean M. , Frank , maybe Nelson Riddle , frank Jr.
Ray,
I drive a V12. That’d be one HEAVY flying saucer!
He should have sold ’em on a Spitfire or maybe a Hurricane…
Ray,
I drive a V12. That’d be one HEAVY flying saucer!
He should have sold ’em on a Spitfire or maybe a Hurricane…
My best way to respond to the topic of this thread is with songs.
Turn on my VCR
Same one I’ve had for years
James Brown on the TAMI show
Same tape I’ve had for years
I sit in my old car
Same one I’ve had for years
Old battery’s running down
It ran for years and years
Turn on the radio
The static hurts my ears
Tell me where would I go
I ain’t been out in years
Turn on the stereo
Its played for years and years
An Otis Redding song
It’s all I own
When the world is running down
You make the best of what’s still around
This is the Police -- for whom I had no use in the ’80’s. I am now appreciative of their pompous pop, but they were still no Squeeze. Squeeze knew what Soul Music is -- witness the “Now she’s gone” parts of Black Coffee. Anyhow, this bit of song captures for me where we are, where we were then, and where we go next, in this world of artifacts.
My best way to respond to the topic of this thread is with songs.
Turn on my VCR
Same one I’ve had for years
James Brown on the TAMI show
Same tape I’ve had for years
I sit in my old car
Same one I’ve had for years
Old battery’s running down
It ran for years and years
Turn on the radio
The static hurts my ears
Tell me where would I go
I ain’t been out in years
Turn on the stereo
Its played for years and years
An Otis Redding song
It’s all I own
When the world is running down
You make the best of what’s still around
This is the Police -- for whom I had no use in the ’80’s. I am now appreciative of their pompous pop, but they were still no Squeeze. Squeeze knew what Soul Music is -- witness the “Now she’s gone” parts of Black Coffee. Anyhow, this bit of song captures for me where we are, where we were then, and where we go next, in this world of artifacts.
Intro:
Sometimes a man and a woman spend 30 or 40 years together
and they don’t belong together
And then one day one of them tries to leave and does
but in a most peculiar way
He: One of these days I’m leaving,
leaving you fool behind.
And on that day you’ll be weeping,
little woman I don’t mind.
Look out in the backyard, mama!
’cause I’m leaving you real soon.
Gonna fly me up to heaven
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me.
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settle down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing off the ground.
He: Oh, woman, are you looking
cause I’m almost 10 feet high, high, high
Woman stop your cooking
’cause I’ll never eat that pie.
I’m on my way to heaven
might even touch the moon.
We’ve needed by my leaving
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me!
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settled down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing on the ground.
He: You never gave me nothing
you never were the kind.
You never gave me children
you never had the time.
Remember me just one
I was born this afternoon.
I’ve got it all together
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me.
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settle down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing on the ground.
I say, you won’t get that on the ground.
What are your doing?
I say, bring that damn thing back down here!
Listen now you hear me
get back down here, all right?
Intro:
Sometimes a man and a woman spend 30 or 40 years together
and they don’t belong together
And then one day one of them tries to leave and does
but in a most peculiar way
He: One of these days I’m leaving,
leaving you fool behind.
And on that day you’ll be weeping,
little woman I don’t mind.
Look out in the backyard, mama!
’cause I’m leaving you real soon.
Gonna fly me up to heaven
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me.
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settle down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing off the ground.
He: Oh, woman, are you looking
cause I’m almost 10 feet high, high, high
Woman stop your cooking
’cause I’ll never eat that pie.
I’m on my way to heaven
might even touch the moon.
We’ve needed by my leaving
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me!
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settled down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing on the ground.
He: You never gave me nothing
you never were the kind.
You never gave me children
you never had the time.
Remember me just one
I was born this afternoon.
I’ve got it all together
in my big red balloon.
She: You’re noting but an old fool
that’s all you’ll ever be.
You’re nothing but an old fool
you know you’ll never beat me.
So stop your silly playing
it’s time you settle down.
And hear me when I’m saying:
You’ll never get that damn thing on the ground.
I say, you won’t get that on the ground.
What are your doing?
I say, bring that damn thing back down here!
Listen now you hear me
get back down here, all right?
The Beatles coulda been hobbits, but JRR Tolkien beat them over the fence!
The Beatles coulda been hobbits, but JRR Tolkien beat them over the fence!