Fleshing out the Skeleton Club

Detail: Skeleton Club flyer, April 11, 1980 (collection Jason Seibert)Punk goodfella-turned-celebrity chef Jason Seibert has donated a wonderful cache of flyers to the Che Underground archives. These artifacts span the late ’70s through the early ’80s and document events at the North Park Lions Club, the International Blend/Kings Road, the Zebra Club and the Skeleton Club.

Detail: Skeleton Club flyer, April 12, 1980 (collection Jason Seibert)It’s high time we take note of that last venue, which did so much to hone the cutting edge of San Diego music. (Full disclosure: Tucked away in North County, I missed out on the Skeleton Club during its brief but influential run at 202 Market St. and 921 Fourth Ave. under the management of rock-‘n’-roll nurse Laura Frasier and a young Tim Mays.)

I believe the chronology runs from 1978-1980, but it will take our digital village to connect these dots. (While I’ve found a few fleeting mentions on Wikipedia and elsewhere, online Skeleton Club references are few and far between.)

Help us tell the Skeleton Club story!

Check out related bands, people, venues and gigs!
Che Underground Trivia Question
The Penetrators

Tags: , , , , , , , , , ,

183 Responses to “Fleshing out the Skeleton Club”

  1. Mmrothenberg Says:

    PS: Does the Weirdos flyer above (April 12, 1980) represent the very last night of the Skeleton Club?

    One of the references I did find to the venue online was in a discussion of all-time favorite live performances. One participant cites “The Weirdo’s the night they closed the skeleton Club on Market Street in San Diego.”

    Other notable online mentions of the Skeleton Club include Jim Woods’ Injections memoir and a citation by Doug Simay, a local artist who seems to have been Laura Frasier’s boyfriend when the Skeleton Club opened:

    “Marjorie [Nodelman] and I were very good friends for many of the years she lived in San Diego. I first met Marjorie when her studio was in the basement of what had years before been
    San Diego’s City Hall and is now Jimmy Love’s at the southwest corner of 5th and G Street. That studio was the site of the first punk scene parties in San Diego. A while later, my then girlfriend and her partner had established the Skeleton Club a couple
    blocks away which was the regular ‘punk palace.’ ”

    Besides the Skeleton Club, can anyone tell us about this formative venue at 5th and G?

  2. Dave Ellison Says:

    How come no one’s mentioned Fairmont Hall (also in North Park)? I think were were a lot more punk shows there than there were at the Lions Club… at least I saw more shows there… great shows by the Cramps and X … I cant remember who else.

  3. Toby Gibson Says:

    Not to nitpick but fairmont hall has been mentioned a couple times. I think it just doesn’t have the worldwide notoriety that the one Germs Flier seems to have lent the NPLC- and it doesn’t have as cool a name as the Skeleton Club.



  4. Scott Harber Says:

    I started going to the Skeleton Club when I was 14 w/ my stepbro Squirrel. Not quite sure how we glommed onto the place as I lived in Poway and my dad and Squirrel lived in Clairemont/Bay Ho. At first my dad would drop us and then Kim Hideous would drive us w/ Wendy Pyro in tow.
    It was kind of overwhelming at first but I do remember the likes of Tony FONO and Tracy FONO scaring the shit out of me but they were actually very cool to us young bucks as we posed no threat to them. There was the No. County surf types like Pergy, the Jenks’ and the Executive folks and the folks who came via NASCO and the military types like Chris Jarhead and Terry Marine.
    Shows were like the GoGos, Weirdos, etc. and I wish I never gave all my fliers away looking back but I never quite understood the idea of taking pictures or reflecting on what is presently happening back then.
    San Diego at that time was a mish mash of surfers, artists, druggies, rough trade leather and random people. The mix of folks is what I miss at most music shows these days. Things get co-opted so quickly now that few cool things can stay that way very long.

  5. Mark Mullen Says:

    I went to most all of the shows.

    Fairmont Hall a lot.

    Adams Ave Theater was where plenty of shows were held.

    I always trip out when I go by there as my brother bought a house near there. It is a fabric store, I have yet to venture inside….Scared

  6. Mmrothenberg Says:

    BTW, I just received a very warm note from Peter “English” Verbrugge, who says he’d be delighted to contribute his historical insights to our venue-tracking efforts.

  7. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Editorial pedantry alert: I know we pronounced it “Fairmont,” but based on these flyers and the address on Fairmount Ave., I’m now certain it’s spelled “Fairmount.”

    This is the building, isn’t it? I went to so many of these things after dark!

    View Larger Map

    PS: Ack!!! Adams Avenue “Theater” or “Theatre”? There’s no consensus among the flyers I’ve reviewed. My archival gyroscope is spinning wildly.

  8. Harold Gee Says:

    How about the short-lived first Skeleton Club, located downstairs in the basement on (I think) 4th Avenue across from Horton Plaza. That place was GREAT, even though it only lasted for a month or two. I remember going to one show, and of course there were many of us who’d been drinking heavily…and after the show was over, and we’d partied ourselves to exhaustion…we all just found a spot and slept on the floor. Damn, that was cool…for a few moments there, I erroneously thought we’d found a home. Little did I know that San Diego did not want us to have a home, and that regardless of whether we established a viable tax-paying club/business…that it would NEVER happen in San Diego, and they do “whatever is necessary” to destroy us. This of course, is what Laura Frasier found out during one of her last negotiations, behind closed doors, with the San Diego Police Department.

  9. mike stobbe Says:

    Brian ( cricket ) nailed it . For me that whole scene was fading by 1984 / 1985 . I graduated from high school in ’84 and had already been going to punk shows in town for a few years here & there . I missed the skeleton club by a bit , most of those very early clubs in San Diego were just before my time . Either to ignorance , or proximity I just couldn’t get to them one way or another .

    Once it started getting really violent at shows we started looking for different places to hangout and avoid trouble . Different groups of people got into different types of music , everything started changing around ’85 / 86 for me in regards to my circle of friends suddenly going in every direction .

  10. Lou Skum Says:

    The Dead Kennedys played at the first Skeleton Club, was it Halloween? We were drinking Mad Dog 20/20 the wine of the century, I know there was a halloween show, I am not sure it was the same night the Dead Kennedys played. Jello Rocks!

  11. Eric Sorensen Says:

    You’re right that it was all very much wherever a show could happen it did. I remember one show that went on in a social club down in South Bay. Not the usual spot but Fairmont was a union hall and they closed it to us following a fight. TSOL’s bassist had taken it into his head to beat up one of my friends who was defending another who had been jumped in the bathroom by a couple of girls.
    Terry Marine, Chris Negro, Mark Rude and Wendy Pyro were all at that show and we weren’t asked back because two jerks started throwing urinal cakes around the place. I cannot remember her name or even who played, but there was this woman who beat the shit out of them.
    If you remember the Skullbusters, I got Brian Thoryk into punk (dubious distinciton that) . I had been trying to get a band started and my guitarist and I went to a rehersal at Brian’s dads. Next thing I know, I’m out and he’s in No Comment (that was painted on the back of his black chopped up scooter.) and I’m helping them figure out how to cover the Clash. Lenny Bell was the original singer, but he went to Switzerland and got kicked out of ski school and ended up in England for the riots. “Little” Paul Lima got his spot even though they were still using Lenny’s P.A.
    Does anyone remember the Zebra Club or Wabash Ballroom shows?
    Thanks for bringing back the past. I remember eating at the Che, since I went to UCSD from ’82.

  12. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>throwing urinal cakes

    Great band name there!

  13. Lou Skum Says:

    We did a show on St. Patricks Day 1981 at the Skeleton Club, The rippers from LA came down with Ron singer from Black Flag and the child molesters and a girl band the anemics. We ate corned beef at McDinnys and drank green beer. A large contingent of LA punks were on hand. Gene King would operate the China Club in the same building. A sort of backstage hangout.

  14. Kevin Says:

    The Zebra Club! Holy sh*t I had forgotten about that! I actually played there and was underage and had to wait in a back storeroom between sets! Dayam, that was a long time ago.

  15. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Kevin: We all spent some down time in that storeroom, which I somehow remember as full of cans, although I don’t remember any food at the club. …

    (Anybody else remember the scene from “Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid” when Bob Dylan’s character is instructed to turn his back on some sort of confrontation between the titular antagonists and read the labels on all the cans lining the far wall? He puts on spectacles, squints and starts reading — Dylan’s voice threads through the background of the rest of the scene: “Beans! Beans! Qua-li-ty sal-mon. Beans! … “)

  16. Dave Doyle Says:

    >The Dead Kennedys played at the first Skeleton Club, was it Halloween? We were drinking Mad Dog 20/20 the wine of the century, I know there was a halloween show, I am not sure it was the same night the Dead Kennedys played. Jello Rocks!

    Lou I’ll look at the flier and find out. I went to that show as well and who could forget it, I even have a guitar pick!

    I remember standing behind East Bay Ray’s Fender amp and watching the tubes glow red and with every full thottled chord blast there’d be a blast of blue plasma within the bottle.

  17. Dave Doyle Says:

    I just remembered to check… it was on Sat. Nov.10th 8pm

  18. Peter Verbrugge Says:

    I was lucky to be a deejay at the second Skeleton Club- I had just arrived from London and had a cool record collection. I recall haggling with Tim Mays over money on my first night! There were some amazing shows at that time, including he infamous night this cool coke dealer Bobby X bought a second show from X for $500. Literally he ponied up for a second set…don’t you wish shit was this simple these days folks? Everyone back then had a cool nickname just abut and we all knew each other. The Zebra Club was amazing too. I’ll have to come up with some better stuff later

    peter v

  19. Louie Procaccino Says:

    Fairmont Hall was the Union Hall for IAT&SE Local 122 ,the stagehand union.I was stage manager for Harlan and Tim at that time.

  20. christian may Says:

    thanks for this little trip down memory lane. i was just a kid at the skeleton club- first time i went my dad dropped me and picked me up! i also spent many a night at the lion’s club- trying to avoid getting my ass kicked by some of the more thuggish types, and hanging out after shows figuring out who was having the after party. fun!

  21. john satterberg Says:

    Hey Scott Harber,
    Actually, it was I who took you to your first show at the North Park Lions Club. As I recall you inadvertenly bounced a beach ball off the top of a nearly six-foot-tall “Sue Cat Woman” looking punk… she then attacked you. Well, I too got into a tangle with just such a gal. Circa 1980/81 at the Lions Club when Black Flag was playing, a tough punk girl started grabbing at my throat, so I pushed her away… her boyfriend saw me push her back, so he quickly punched me in the eye… a black eye at Black Flag. Since I was just 17 and living at home I had to tell my folks it was just an accident, and not as a result of that awful punk rock music. It was indeed a nice feeling to have been execepted… and/or tolerated by people like Terry Marine, Chris Jarhead, M. Rude and the like, they were real swell guys. Hey do ya’ll remember when Tim Grizwold’s band “The Evasions” played in Balboa Park at the Blind Clinic… It was a strange scene in a dark and weird location… I did’nt drink much back then, but I did that night. Man we were lucky to have been able to see some great punk shows back in those days… a special thanks to Tim Mays and Mark Rude for putting on the shows. A few of the great bands that I remember seeing were: Injections, Weirdos at the Skeleton Club, Alice Bag Band, Zippers, Stingers at the Skeleton Club. Dead Kennedys, Skullbusters at the Lions Club. X, Gun Club and the Blasters at the Back Door. X at the Roxy in Pacific Beach. Ramones at Montezuma Hall. Penetrators at the La Paloma Theater, Cramps at Adams Ave Theater. Tell Tale Hearts at the Cavern Club Greenwich Village West. Sonic Youth at the Back Door… doing their entire “daydream nation” album… and from my home town of Poway “The Plastics” featuring Dave Ellison, Sam Wilson, Scott Harber and Skip Barton, playing a party at skip’s house in 1980. Another great show in Poway was the “Rockin’ Dogs” playing a party for Jason Seibert’s lil’ sister at Jason’s house… Jason had a great pet rat named “scabies.” I still have a few old flyers from that era but not many photos. We sure had some good times!… I only wish that I could have then more appreciated just what a great scene it was, before all the violence moved in.

  22. Robin Says:

    I remember opening night at the 5th and Market Skeleton Club. It was the first time I’d ever seen or heard of slam dancing. My boyfriend and I showed up in surfer clothes and stared in awe all night.

  23. bruce injection Says:

    I want a spring ’09 INJECTIONS reunion in SD !! I want to see all the 50 somethings slam dancing again !!

    Bruce Injection

  24. john satterberg Says:

    The Injections were then, and continue to be my favorite San Diego band… the question is would Lou Skum be game. Mr. Skum is pals with Tom Grizwold. Perhaps Tom can book another show after some 30 years since having done so at International Blend, if I recall correctly. Can’t believe Radioactive Records did’nt send ‘um on a world tour. The Injections single, “Prison Walls / Lies,” has long been an all-time favorite of mine.

  25. Robin Says:

    >>I want a spring ‘09 INJECTIONS reunion in SD !! I want to see all the 50 somethings slam dancing again !!

    Oh yeah! I may have stared in awe that night. But now I can stomp and throw an elbow. (And, for the record, I am 40 something. Skeleton never carded.)

  26. bruce Injection Says:

    I will take care of Lou. We just need a venue, a bass player, and everyone alive from’79!! We were never recorded properly but there is a lot of bootleg stuff out there on the web. I’ve recently discovered our “lost” tape, mixed. Need to digitally enhance and restore it for a production.

    I’d like to see the youngest and coolest current SD band back us if we can pull off a reunion. That was always our spirit; young and notorious. Any ideas?????

    Bruce Injection

  27. Tobylifehater Says:

    There’s a band from Kona called the Americans that might be good. They relocated to San Diego and are the offspring of one of the Slingerland brothers (an old North County San Diego family) from Encinitas.

    Their myspace is here: http://www.myspace.com/theamericans

    They come with my endorsement as cool kids and hard rocking punks, for what that’s worth.

  28. bruce injection Says:

    Cool band !! Might be too hard, (metal), for us. Let’s check them out and how about some others?? Maybe art-type bands, or even surf?? Who knows, just want something different.

    Bruce Injection

  29. Tobylifehater Says:

    Yeah- when they left Kona they were all Thrash and Misfits covers- they seem to have polished their act in California’s finest city.

  30. Robin Says:

    Excuse me? Did Bruce Injection just say, for a public written record, “They might be too hard for us,”?! Take-backs are allowed. Do you need one?

  31. Bruce Injection Says:

    Hi Robin. I don’t know if we know each other?? I like your sense of humor and wit!

    No take-back. LOL. I was trying to convey that the Injections never had any type of “metal” sound, nor were any metal bands our influences.

    You can be very hard while still being soft, if you know what I mean; like Lou Reeds BERLIN.

    Bruce Injection

  32. Robin Says:

    I was in your audience a few times. We may have talked, but never enough to know each other. I was usually physically spent by the end of a show.

    Of course, I know what you mean. You mean: The youngsters’ metal sound may not be compatible with the raw, percussive, early punk aesthetic of the Injectors. You only accidentally chose words that imply we have gotten old and soft.

  33. Robin Says:

    Oh, and I like you too, Bruce Injection. (Sorry about screwing up the band name in the last post.)

  34. Bruce Injection Says:

    Robin -- Hard to believe anyone alive ever saw us! Yeah, you know when we started most people were listening to the Eagles, Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, etc.. Two days later they shaved their heads and were coming to see us and buying pistols and clash records. Nothing wrong with that though, just interesting social commentary.

    I like your early, percussive, punk aesthetic quote. When we first started (’78?), I don’t think we knew of the “punk” designation. We were just trying to play “different” music and a lot of kids with leather and spiky hair started coming to our shows. And don’t forget the FONO influence on the scene; lots of trouble and violence ensued….

    The only “metal” I’d heard at this time was probably Iron Butterfly and Black Sabbath!! We were definitely big fans of Velvet Underground and the Stooges.

    I hope none of us are old or soft yet! I’m trying to convince Lou to do a SD reunion show but it won’t be in May, a little later I think. We all have kids.


  35. bruce injection Says:

    Travel from where?? I’ve always thought that quality is quality regardless of genre. Dark side of the Moon, Sgt. Pepper, Pet sounds, even AC/DC have and always will rock.!

    The coffee and alarm clock went off with Elvis, beatles, Pistols, and perhaps even Nirvana. It doesn’t happen often though, eh??

    That’s why I never listened to “punk” after 1980; what could you possibly say after Fear, Germs, Dead Kennedys, etc… I think it began in ’77 and was over in ’80.


  36. Robin Says:

    Once a guy names himself Jello Biafra, he’s pretty much claimed the last word.

    Henry Rollins stayed fun for awhile though. I…I liked Suicidal Tendencies. There. I said it.

    Travel: from the Virginia suburbs of DC. I still have family and friends in So.Cal. I’d definitely make the effort to coordinate a trip around a reunion.

  37. bruce injection Says:

    I…I like your stutter. I like the…the Carpenters, (and Lady Sovereign). Are you married to a senator or a congressman??

    SD sometime in ’09, maybe haloween?, 30 years since our coming out.


  38. Robin Says:

    How could any real punk ignore the brilliance of “Hangin’ around, nothing to do but frown.”? And the geniuses got that shit on Top 40 am radio!

    Not married to a senator or congressman. I do policy research.

    I no longer feel uncomfortable acknowledging my dirthead roots. I’m sure they’re one reason I kept all my hair throughout the 80s. “Physical Grafitti” Side 3 feels like home.

    I also acknowledge that anyone signed to any major label is making money for the corporation, regardless of genre. Radio rap is sad these days- just like rock. Also, just like rock, there’s some good underground, unsigned stuff circulating. The revolution is quietly happening. Vendetta has some moments. Wu-Tang, while undeniably commerical, is still rocking the house.

    Halloween- maybe. Other fall times would be better. The daughter will want me to take her trick or treating.

  39. bruce injection Says:

    Rainy Days and Mondays always get me down… geniuses. Poor Karen.

    Maybe late summer. Although trick or treat with the injections isn’t bad!!!


  40. dave ellison Says:

    >>America is desperate for a cultural revolution. The time is ripe.

    Maybe it’s been going on all along and we’re just too busy with everyday life to find out about it. Or maybe it’s so different from our generation’s idea of a cultural revolution that we wouldn’t know it if it bit us in the face.

    So many people talk about how bad music on the radio is… but they forget it was just as bad 25 years ago, they just never listened to it.

  41. Tobylifehater Says:

    I had this idea a while back that the revolution is that this generation isn’t buying OUR bullshit- they’re rejecting OUR beliefs, as really in a lot of lights it looks like we didn’t make much priogress for all of our efforts (though it can also be seen that punk changed everything, or was at least part of the evolution of everything changing.) Maybe their rebellion comes in the form of being consumers and buying into all of the pop culture, the antithesis of what most of us were about. Embracing the Mastercard and MacDonalds culture when held up to the anti-fashion and anti-establishment of the early days of punk could very well be seen as every bit as radical a backlash.

    My daughter and her friends don’t want credit, don’t like computers or cel phones all that much, and pour over my old vinyl and spin it all day long. I feel like there’s still hope.

  42. bruce injection Says:


  43. Robin Says:

    As a young band’s den mom: They think we’re funny for getting worked up about a “Corporate Man” instead of recognizing the nuanced circumstances that lead to an exploitative consumerist society. They see the irony when we don’t recognize our own responsibility for participating in and supporting that society. They think we’re funny for becoming the new hippies: “Hippies are over. We’re punks…Hey, you young kids, what’s wrong with you? You should want to be punks. Like us.” They feel an urgency to solve scary problems like global warming, world hunger, genocide. They believe in a pragmatic, efficient, cooperative approach to solving those problems. They have little patience for ranting and polarizing. And none for slacking.

    I am so happy it’s their turn now.

  44. Robin Says:

    Nice recording, Bruce.

  45. Bruce Injection Says:

    yeah, nice recording of an obscure band covering an obscure band 25 years later! What could be better -- what taste!!


  46. MadMike Says:

    dont suppose you have a copy the original you could share eh?

    I’d love to still have it in my collection

  47. Robin Says:

    “Every sha la la la, every whoa-o-o-o still shines.”

    25 years and obscurity are only negative if you allow corporate marketing to define taste. It’s a good thing to be liked after 25 years, Bruce.

  48. bruce Injection Says:

    I’m going to start a Carpenters thread if this goes any further !! You’re killing me. It’s yesterday once more……….

    We are in the process of finding our original tapes etc.. We recorded so little music yet new stuff, ( and covers!), spring up all the time.

    Bruce Injection

  49. Robin Says:

    Funny, but it seems I always wind up here with you.

    Please post when you have music to share with the whole class.

    Are you making music now?

    Isn’t every thread a Carpenters thread?

  50. Robin Says:

    I had not heard of it, but that made my day. And I was already having a really great day.

  51. Bruce Injection Says:

  52. miked Says:

    IF anyone cares…you can find 2 mp3s of one of the bands on the April 11th, 1980 flier, the Nu-Beams here.


    This is actually the still underconstruction website of another Orange County early 80s band the Tweezers.


  53. Robin Says:

    Dude, that Sonic Youth video is beautiful. I got shivers. Especially the footage of Karen drumming in the yellow dress. Ah! I gotta go watch it again.

  54. bruce injection Says:

    Robin, you’re clearly a person of superior intellect and taste !!

    bruce Injection

  55. Robin Says:

    Karen elevates us all.

  56. Robin Says:

    Back then I didn’t understand what it meant to be able to sing while drumming. Damn.

  57. Bruce Injection Says:

    Did you say somewhere you play this Too?? I’m a classical guitarist, many years now….

  58. Bruce Injection Says:

    This was John Lennons favorite, quite an endorsement! Karen always seems so smart, and sad. I like from 3:15 on especially


    Bruce Injection

  59. Robin Says:

    Thanks! Yes, I was playing it 5 minutes ago. Not with Williams’ vibrato, but playing it nonetheless. Have you heard Parkening play it? I couldn’t find it on YouTube. I heard him perform it with St. Martin in the Fields in 1991 and was so overwhelmed I wept. His version is slower and more emotional. Though I prefer Parkening on that piece, in general, I love Williams more. Of the technical greats, he expresses the most joy in playing and the most natural connection with his audience.

    Charlie Byrd arranged the whole concerto as a guitar solo, but as far as I know, never recorded it. It’s a nice arrangement. Interesting how he translated the string parts for guitar.

    What’s in your repertoire? And when did you start playing classical?

    I’m now inspired to go play some more. Williams will do that for you.

  60. Bruce Injection Says:

    I left SD around ’80 and spent the next 5 or 6 years getting a music degree. Performance at first, then Music Ed. Taught elementary Ed for many years then became a sailing teacher for about 10 years. I have carpal tunnel pretty bad so I have to play on and off. Have been in a few “art” bands and one good ska band. Other than that all classical.

    Bach, Vivaldi, Ponce, Villa-Lobos, Sor, Giuliani, etc…….

    Recently started the study of jazz;Wow!! I don’t really like jazz but I was so intrigued by the chording and improv. It has totally blown me away, how much more, in some ways, jazz players know than classical. That could fill a whole thread.

    I played your piece at my senior recital.


  61. the P Gargoyle Says:

    Injections reunion. I am there !!

    PS..somehow I need to get your email address.


  62. Bruce Injection Says:

    Joanne -- We will do this, and it will be great! I just don’t know when.
    Lou and I have commitments and, of course, distance.

    We need a cool bass player, equipment, and venue. Lots of people talking about this already but Lou can’t do it in May, so maybe summer??

    I’ll get your e-mail from Lou.

    Can’t wait to talk to you. What happened to Lisa ???


  63. the P Gargoyle Says:

    I ran into DT in the weirdest way. It was at a work meeting…I didn’t recognize him . After the meeting he came out and asked me if I had played drums with the Injections. It was surreal. However, he told me that Lisa passed away. I will get more details and let you know. Lou has my email address. I can’t wait to hear from you.

  64. the P Gargoyle Says:

    PS I love the idea of a show in the Summer. This blog has been an incredible conduit for everyone. Thanks Matthew for all the work you do to keep this going.

  65. Robin Says:

    I am so sorry to hear about Lisa.

  66. Robin Says:

    Jazz is definitely the most technically demanding genre. Useful to play even if it’s not what you want to listen. Some of it is more of a spectator sport, a display of athletic prowess, than artistic music. Gypsy jazz manages to be both.

    Check this out: http://www.paulpieper.com/live/
    Especially listen to the Signals track. This guy is fun to watch. I saw Alex Skolnick’s jaw drop when Paul was leading in for him.

    Do you play Villa-Lobos’ Prelude in E minor? Nice harmonics.

  67. Bruce Injection Says:

    You obviously know your stuff ! You are right on about the playing and listening; I get bored listening to jazz but I am intrigued, even infatuated with the technical level and differences between jazz and classical. I have learned hundreds of new chords and scales, yet for no actual reason?? I have played a variety of Ponce and Villa-Lobos preludes but only have one or two in my current “memory” repertoire.

    I think we have strayed as far as one can from che threads! Oh well, as long as we throw in some Injections, Carpenters, and Jello Biafra now and then.


  68. Robin Says:

    Does it help that Skolnik was with Testament, which got their name from S.O.D.’s Billy Milano?

    What do you mean you learned the chords for no reason? You probably have longer reach, more dexterity, cleaner sound, more ease with the chords you do want to use, and an expanded concept of what you want to play. It’s useful in the same way that scales and slur exercises are. You don’t want to listen to them. But they make you play better.

    Do you still shape your nails?

  69. Robin Says:

    OK, you have my e-mail; we can get a room. Man, this is just like old times.

  70. dylan rogers Says:

    I am playing in a band with this cat Jim, he had a band that played at The Skeleton Club, Zebra, Adams called The Sting Rays, They also went under the name The Heaters and The Imposters. They play surf music(sting rays) and punk(heaters, imposters).
    Jim dug out some photos yesterday of the band, two surfer dudes and Jim looking like Franky Fix of CRIME, pretty cool! He also had a great photo of himself playing a Moserite up in a tree.

  71. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Does anybody here know what became of Laura Frasier?

  72. Bruce Injection Says:

    Does anybody here know what became of this thread!

  73. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Does anybody here know what became of this thread!

    Bruce: Gosh, I have no idea! Oh, wait … We’re soaking in it. :-)

    Once more, with feeling: You can find any past post by using the blog’s own Search function. You might have to click back through Older Entries a few times, but it’s all there.

    What’s more, there’s this thing called Google at http://www.google.com. It’s basically a plain white page with one box you type words in and press a search button. If you go there and type in just about anything that’s ever been discussed on the blog, the Google “search engine” will find it within milliseconds, usually on the first page of results. (It’s very cool … I think these guys may really be onto something!)

    Case in point: Go to this Google site I mentioned, type the words “skeleton club” into the text box, and click on the button directly below the text box labeled “Google search.” (This initiates what’s known as a “Google search,” which I’m guessing is why those words are there.) Amazingly, the first two results (out of 2,660,000) lead back … To this thread!

    Now — as I’ve mentioned about a half-dozen times — we’re going to try to get more elegant and comprehensive with the search capabilities and the presentation of recent comments on a range of posts.

    But unless he’s ready to start slinging PHP code and testing WordPress plug-ins himself, anybody who keeps asking for these enhancements over and over and over is quickly going to start sounding like an impatient five-year-old on a long car trip!

    Don’t make me turn this blog around. And pee before we get back in the browser. :-)

  74. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Now, if we can stop blogging about blogging for a little while … Does anybody here know what became of Laura Frasier?

  75. mcc Says:

    (what the hell is this blogging shit everyone keeps yammering about?!?!?)

    anyway….i always thought it cool that laura was a nurse by day.

  76. mcc Says:

    that was my understanding at least.
    in other words she was a working girl.

    in those days that was important.
    in a few short years the term “entrepeneur” came to be synonymous with a real american go-getter…..someone who had their priorities straight….someone who’s moral-compass and patriotism were on the same page….perhaps even a genius.
    profit became king.

    i miss those days when people did stuff simply for their love of it.

  77. Bruce Injection Says:

    >>”What’s more, there’s this thing called Google ”

    What a ball-buster! I was actually referring to the fact that we had not seen SKEL CLUB thread in a long time and it was seminal to many things that came after it.

    >>”someone who’s moral-compass and patriotism…” I have none of either Clay, I hope we’re still cool:)

    Laura Frasier came, (in her nurses uniform), to the Herman Ave apartment to “audition” the Injections to see if we could play at the first Skel Club. She liked us and gave us our first break.

  78. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Laura Frasier came, (in her nurses uniform), to the Herman Ave apartment to “audition” the Injections to see if we could play at the first Skel Club. She liked us and gave us our first break.

    Bruce: I keep hearing the Dolls’ version of “Rock ‘n’ Roll Nurse” every time this subject arises!

  79. Bruce Injections Says:

    Was “Buster Poindexter” gay?? Not that there’s anything wrong with it..just wondering, historically.

    Laura was a cool rock ‘n’ roll nurse..an ADULT who loved the music we were making…how weird is that??

    I thought someone said she too was dead but that is completely unsubstantiated!!

  80. Ray Brandes Says:

    >>What a ball-buster! I was actually referring to the fact that we had not seen SKEL CLUB thread in a long time and it was seminal to many things that came after it.

    Currently, the only way to bring back an old post is to do what you and Matt and Clay have been doing--to occasionally interject some new life into them with a new comment every now and then.

    I wonder if it’s possible to create an index of threads by name, so that people who are relative newcomers can peruse the wealth of this site. I imagine it can be very time consuming to keep hitting “older posts” often times readers might not even know where to begin with a keyword search . . .

  81. Bruce Injection Says:

    RAY -- Matt is going to give you hell for this line of thinking.

    >>”anybody who keeps asking for these enhancements over and over and over is quickly going to start sounding like an impatient five-year-old on a long car trip!”


    1. You do not talk about the Blog.

    2. You DO NOT TALK about the Blog.


  82. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>RAY – Matt is going to give you hell for this line of thinking.

    Everybody gets a pony, a baby elephant and all the ice cream they can eat! :-)

    Seriously, I think it’s a cool idea, and I appreciate creative thinking about surmounting our architectural obstacles. Implementing is the challenge … probably not insurmountable, but it’s gonna take a little while. I like hearing new solutions, though!

  83. Bruce Injection Says:

    Shit…no one said anything about ice cream and ponies!!

    Alright…mums the word. (maybe we need a Howard Rourke)

    I always wanted to pretend I was an architect!

  84. Mikel Says:

    I’m transcribing (in several parts) this interview with the elusive Laura Frasier that appeared in Quasi-Substitute #9 (March ’80). It was accompanied by a wonderful Peggy Sue Amison photo (you might contact Peggy in Ireland if you’re interested):

    Q-SUB: Why did you start promoting concerts?

    LAURA: “Because I wanted to see shows and there weren’t any going on right then. It’s because I met all these weirdos — it’s funny, because I was just looking at that Substitute with Rudford’s [Restaurant on El Cajon Blvd.] on the cover, and inside there’s a little story about the Penetrators housewarming party, which is the first party I went to and met all these people. I just wanted to get involved, because everybody was doing it all themselves anyway.”

    Q: How did your first couple of shows go?

    L: “First show did great and we had all kinds of trouble, and Harold (Gee) and I each made $100. And then the second show Harold and I lost $100 between us, because I was about to go wildly enthusiastic after the first show — I went completely bonkers and rented out Carpenters Hall and you know what happened.Instead of the expected 850 crowd only 300 people showed up. I’m still glad when 300 people show up — sell out the Skeleton Club.”

    Q: What happened after that? Did it dampen your enthusiasm any?

    L: “Well, it taught me some real good lessons, but it didn’t dampen my enthusiasm. Making mistakes never dampens my enthusiasm, it just charges me up to learn what I could do… God, I learned so much at that Carpenters Hall.”

    Q: So when did you start looking for your own club?

    L: “I think it was, I used the Lions Club that time with Renee [Edgington], for the Plugz, and then I booked the Alley Cats. I didn’t want to book the Lions Club until I got the Alley Cats, and I got the Alley Cats and I lost the Lions Club. So it was something that I planned to do like a month from the time that I actually did it. But because I didn’t have a place for the Alley Cats concert, and Harold had put me in touch with Adrienne Webb who had the building the old Skeleton club was in, I just rushed it through. Our own place is always what I wanted, because it seems a waste to give other people money, plus you’re always competing with the Lions and the Boys Clubs and the bar mitzvahs for your place.”

  85. Mikel Says:

    Laura Frasier interview, part two.

    Q: Why’d you pick downtown?

    L: “Because the rent’s cheap, I figured there were fewer families to hassle, and I thought we’d look like good citizens in comparison with the rest of the people down there, which I still think is true.”

    Q: Do you think the Skeleton Club’s been successful?

    L (beaming): “Yes! Amazingly successful! I thought we’d just piddle along, you know — just trying to get stray people in, just barely breaking even, struggling along, no one knowing about us and no one wanting to come downtown. And it’s still all those things to a point, but when we can do two shows, it seems to be getting better and better. I made $600 on the Alley Cats show, play I paid everybody that worked for me — the first time I’ve ever done that.”

    Q: So are you making money now, overall?

    L: “Not real consistently. We’re spending a lot of money still. I make — well, when like Gene King does a show I make $125, and I’ve hardly been putting any shows on. So I make more money when I put on my own shows, $150, $175. I haven’t had any money-losing shows since the Young Canadians — I mean since the Subhumans, not the Young — well, the Young Canadians was a money-losing show for different reasons. I still have to give all those people free admission again.”

  86. Tom Griswold Says:

    Hey, that cover of “Prison Walls” is by David Stampone’s band “Free*Stars”. Dave is a SD ex-patriot living in Phillie, and was a looong time DJ on KCR.

  87. Bruce Injection Says:

    Hey Thanks Tom! I have the mp3 but never knew who covered it, (or why)? Never knew David Stampone.

    Kind of an obscure cover of kind of an obscure band.

    I like their version better!!


  88. Bruce Injection Says:

    Can anyone help identify the guy on the right. That’s Cliff C. with beer can in hand. Front Street back porch.


  89. Mikel Says:

    Laura Fraser interview, part four.

    L [continuing directly]: “So that night he told me to turn it down once. I came back out and, just instantly, he’s going, “Get back in there and turn it down again,” so I ran back in and turned down again. I came back out the second time and he’s going, “This is it. I’m shutting the place down and impounding the equipment.” He marches up to the stage, and I’m right behind him, stops the Unknowns from playing. OK, fine. I get on the PA and say we can’t solve this problem tonight, we’ll solve it later, you can get tickets at the door and you’ll get admitted free. I can’t give your money because I had to pay the out-of-town bands, the Young Canadians, you know I wasn’t gonna make them not get any money, since they were on the road a long time. So then I said if we’re quiet we can all stay and I wanted everyone to stay and talk, and the cop thought I meant that the performance was going to start again — this is what he told me Sunday night, when I met with him and Sgt. Decker — that’s what he told me he understood me to be saying. So that enraged him and he clamped my hands behind my back and led me off to jail. Isn’t that weird? When I feel them closing the handcuffs around my wrists, I laughed out loud, even though it wasn’t really funny, but it seemed so absurd I couldn’t do anything else but laugh at the moment. So I’m sitting in the back of this squad car, more and more cops are arriving, people are spilling out of the Skelton Club with this weird look on their face. And I’m going, Oh, no, people are getting beaten and arrested inside, and I thought it was a full-blown massacre. But then it turned out only five people got arrested. So everyone was pretty cool, I guess. So everyone handled themselves real well. I’m very proud.”

  90. mcc Says:

    very generous of you mikel! i am assuming it’s you mr. toombs.
    yeah laura was cool…..no doubt about that.

    unlike mr. x…..now how on earth did peter english ever come to the conclusion that bobby-x was in any way cool?
    just because he thought he could buy people?!?!?
    i mean he would buy SOME people. he could buy an entire x show.
    i have a nice story about that man…but it’s late and it’s less than nice and since we’re all so into not in any way embarassing others around here.
    i’ll just say nighty night….undergrounders.

    this cool coke-dealer…wow.

    only here at che!

  91. mcc Says:

    well….actually there’s more than one story.

    but we’ll leave it to none since that’s who we are.

    : )

  92. Dean Curtis Says:

    Bruce Injection wrote:
    >Can anyone help identify the guy on the right. That’s Cliff C. with >beer can in hand. Front Street back porch.


    I believe it’s David Klowden.

  93. Bruce Injection Says:

    Cool! Next question who is David Klowden??

  94. Mark Dittman Says:

    I remember Laura comming out to my house to audition us (The Big). She was in her nurse’s uniform which we thought was great. As I remember we played a few nights there. One night the crowd was really pumped up so we got our equiptment out to the trucks fast. The Dawts, I believe were on after us and I heard they got they’re stuff thrashed after we left. I would love to hear from anyone who was there and if anyone has any recordings with The Big at about this time that would be great as I have none.

  95. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Next question who is David Klowden??

    Bruce: A k a Dave GI, singer for 5051 … Then drummer for the Tell-Tale Hearts and other notable bands on this site. Valued contributor!

  96. Mmrothenberg Says:

    PS: All this Laura Frasier goodness (thanks, Mikel and Mark and Co.!) and still no word on her whereabouts …

  97. Bruce Injection Says:

    Thanks Matt! I guess I hung out with this dude since he was at my house in the above picture with my close friends!!

    Can’t place him now.

  98. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Can’t place him now.

    Bruce: Check out David’s 5051 bio in the “Related Bands” section. …

  99. Mikel Says:

    For Big Mark Dittman’s amusement, our (Q-Sub) review of that night:

    at the Skeleton Club
    28 December [1979]

    Alright! Fight night at the Skeleton Club! I would’ve thought they restricted this sort of activity to the old Coliseum down the street, but I’m afraid not.

    The action commenced with the appropriately-named Big, hulking macho types w/Marine singer who tried to slug out the music on their instruments and usually lost, most obviously on a version of Jonathan Richman’s ‘Roadrunner’ which never got out of first gear.

    Next came the equally-as-useless-if-oddly-spelled Dawts, power pop poseurs with white shirts and rock star pretensions whose set were [sic] prematurely ended when a couple of menacing bodies hurled across the stage at them. Punches were thrown, jackets removed, names called and the whole bit, and though no further serious incidents were forthcoming, the S-Club powers-that-be were very visibly on edge (and onstage) for the rest of the evening.

    Finally, the Flyboys came on a la local faves the Crowd with “the management doesn’t want any more fights” witticisms, and (also a la the Crowd) they proceeded to play a set of tight, fast, not-quite-distinguished rock and roll, the difference being that, unlike the Huntington Beach boys, the Flyboys did it especially well. (A telling divergence: For their Yardbirds cover the Crowd picked “For Your Love,” while the Flyboys selected the more essential “Heart Full of Soul.”)

  100. Mark Dittman Says:

    Thanks Mikel. I’m suprised a review was even written much less saved. Of course I don’t agree with the reviewer but what band does? Besides, I may be a little bias (ya think). I would love to hear from anyone else with memories of The Big or the latter version, The Soldiers of Fortune. Thanks.

  101. Mikel Says:

    Mark, I think the fisticuffs were the only reason the review got printed. And as for the Crowd show referenced, it was Plugz/Upbeats/Crowd at the Lions Club and we had a cool photo of the, um, crowd.

  102. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Thanks, Mikel!

    You might be able to post this photo of Jello Biafra from the Dead Kennedys show at the original Skeleton Club. (I bet someone will recognize him/herself there at the side of the ‘stage.’) I don’t know who Matthew Giedt is, but he took it (and we ran it in Q-Sub). best, mikel


    Mikel Toombs
    Music writer, San Diego News Network”

  103. Bruce Injection Says:

    LOVE this thread, as always!

    This photo reminds me of how all the original “Punk” bands looked in the early days. A long way from the leather and chains that soon followed!!

  104. Bruce Injection Says:

    BTW, the audience appears pretty tame too!!

  105. Mmrothenberg Says:

    So I’m guessing 1978 for this photo?

  106. Bruce Injection Says:

    Had to be ’78. The kids in the background are wearing sneakers and sweaters.

    Even Jello has a Rick Springfield hair-do!

    A year later everyone looked like Battalion of Saints and FONO!

  107. Mikel Says:

    > Had to be ‘78. The kids in the background are wearing sneakers and sweaters.

    Ha! This was actually late ’79 (11/10) but you’re right, Bruce, it’s the twilight of the sneaker/sweater set….

  108. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Even Jello has a Rick Springfield hair-do!

    Feathered Jello!

  109. Bruce Injection Says:

    Documented proof that I had spikey hair before Jello Biafra! haha

  110. JAS Says:

    The 11-10-79 DK Skeleton Show is written up in the Reader’s “50 Historic Local Concerts”

    11-10-79 -- the Dead Kennedys: On this night, the Dead Kennedys played the final concert ever staged at the city’s first punk venue, downtown’s original Skeleton Club on Fourth Avenue, across from Horton Plaza. Owner Laura Fraser was forced to close the basement level club due to problems with the hundred year-old building meeting fire codes.

    In addition, plainclothes police frequently ticketed patrons for everything from public drunkenness and drug possession to weapons violations, lewd behavior, and even for spitting on the sidewalk outside the club, prompting Fraser to allege municipal harassment.

    When the Dead Kennedys hit the Club’s four-inch-high stage, lead singer Jello Biafra had just recently run for Mayor of San Francisco, coming in at fourth place. Around 300 patrons paid $3.50 to see the band speed through a topical set that included the anti- totalitarianism anthem “Holiday in Cambodia,” “Kill the Poor” (concerning urban neutron bombs), and “California Über Alles,” about a world where political punching bag Jerry Brown is President. One local paper called the mosh pit “a battleground that formed in front of, and at times on, the stage.”

    The Skeleton Club reopened on December 7, 1979, at 202 West Market Street, in a locale abandoned by the previous – and ultimately doomed – tenant; Climax Limited Disco World.


  111. JAS Says:

    And this one --
    12/7/79: The city’s first punk venue, downtown’s Skeleton Club, reopened at 202 West Market Street. The original locale on Fourth Avenue, across from Horton Plaza, had been shut down the previous month due to zoning problems and what club owner Laura Fraser alleged to be police and municipal harassment.

    The new Skeleton Club held 350 people and served only soft drinks and coffee, though Fraser hoped to open a bar and restaurant next door. On opening night, the Penetrators, Mature Adults, Non, and the Rick Elias Band all performed free, donating door proceeds to Fraser’s fund to keep the club operating. They sold 325 tickets at $3 apiece.

    “I remember a room full of sweaty people that were crushed against the stage,” recalls former Penetrator Gary Heffern. “The lighting in the place was horrible, there were couches that were spread around, and the place stank. I was overwhelmed and shocked at the amount of people that showed up.”

    However, fire marshals appeared and announced the room was 100 people over its capacity, even though the tables and chairs had been removed for the event. Owner Fraser took the stage and asked if any volunteers would depart in return for a refund. “Police are ticketing cars parked illegally on Market Street,” she announced, “so maybe those people should be the ones to leave.”

    Fraser later told local magazine Kicks (January 1980), “Can you imagine? I’ve never done anything that ridiculous before in my life.” Fire marshals were eventually satisfied, and the show continued. The club would remain embattled on many fronts, until its eventual demise.

    Mark DeCerbo of Four Eyes emailed “Ah, The Skeleton Club. Kinda dark and seedy, but not in a bad way mind you, it had a cool rock vibe to it. It was like San Diego’s version of Liverpool’s Cavern Club, I imagine, though I’ve never been to England. I remember it was started by a nurse, Laura Fraser, who was really into original music. Four Eyes only played there two or three times, because it was mostly a punk scene and we were more of a power pop band…I don’t remember if we got paid but, if we did, it wasn’t much.”

    From Bob Sale: “For years I’ve wondered where on Market it was, because that was our rehearsal space (The Rick Elias Band) for a while along with a great place to do gigs. I remember that opening night — we weren’t punk and I’m sure only three people liked us, but it had a giant vibe. There was an old guy who managed the place and whose office was out back, always had a gun sitting on his desk. Downtown rocked back then — really seedy; not seedy as compared to big cities, but seedy for San Diego. Great memories.”

    And Marc “Twang”: “I hardly remember that night … did Rick kick a trash can from the stage at FONO? It was all so new to me after having been in the band Listen for 7 years playing Beach Boys and Yes tunes and then finding myself amongst a bunch of punk rockers in sleazy downtown SD .. were the Naughty Sweeties there? Ah, the (sort of) memories …”

  112. Mmrothenberg Says:

    JAS: Thanks for all this stuff! I’m still hoping to figure out what the last show was at the Market St. address …

  113. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>11-10-79 – the Dead Kennedys: On this night, the Dead Kennedys played the final concert ever staged at the city’s first punk venue, downtown’s original Skeleton Club on Fourth Avenue, across from Horton Plaza.

    JAS: Weird … The San Diego Concert Archive claims the Weirdos, the Adaptors and the Standbys played the Skeleton that night. Somebody tell SDCA’s Jon Moore!

  114. Mikel Says:

    > Weird … The San Diego Concert Archive claims the Weirdos, the Adaptors and the Standbys played the Skeleton that night.

    I don’t know how the Weirdos got in there, but the Adaptors and the Standbys did indeed play that night before the DKs.

  115. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Mikel: So the photo above of Jello you provided me is from the last night at the original Skeleton? Very cool! I can see why the cops would break up an angry mob like that. :-)

  116. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>The Skeleton Club reopened on December 7, 1979, at 202 West Market Street, in a locale abandoned by the previous – and ultimately doomed – tenant; Climax Limited Disco World.

    Uhhhhh … What does “climax limited” suggest to you? I’m envisioning a traditional and notoriously unsuccessful form of birth control.

  117. Bruce Injection Says:

    >>”I can see why the cops would break up an angry mob like that. :-)

    YEAH…I remember all the early shows having the same “wild” audiences. Never understood why SDPD was so brutal!! Bastards!

  118. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Never understood why SDPD was so brutal!!

    Bruce: If Laura and Tim had played it smart, they would’ve let the PD-5 police rock band headline a few shows. Problem solved! :-)

  119. Bruce Injection Says:

    >>”Bruce: If Laura and Tim had played it smart, they would’ve let the PD-5 police rock band headline a few shows. Problem solved!”

    Where is that photo of Lou Skum, front and center, watching PD-5??

    I love it…Be My Friend maybe???

  120. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>The next night, the DKs performed at Tijuana’s Teatro Casa de la Cultura, in a show also promoted by Mays (tickets: $5). Outside the venue, Mexican police arrested several San Diegans “for no apparent reason,” according to newspaper columnist George Varga.

    JAS: I was at that gig, and I think some of our regulars were among the kids detained by the cops. Great show, though!

  121. Mikel Says:

    [One final note about the final show at the original, 4th Ave. Skeleton Club, from Q-Sub]

    … First, the “Mature Adults” (the ex-Tokyos with hastily recruited new guitarist) explained that their debut the next week had been cancelled due to the club being shut down, then an aimlessly wandering promoter type filled in the details — something about $2-3 thousand of work needed to satisfy the fire marshals [2009 note: the fire marshals were in attendance at the previous show], although he promised the Skeleton Club name (and spirit) would live on shortly (a month?) in another location (probably also downtown — why the attraction?). [Remember, this was downtown 1979.]

  122. Bruce Injection Says:

    We made our non performing “debut” at Skel Club 1. Then we were approached by Laura to play the new Skel Club 2. What was the time lag here??

    Also soon after we were playing Spirit, Zebra Club, NPLC….when did these appear??

    Hurray for Thanksgiving bloggers…no families…no conscience??

  123. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>We made our non performing “debut” at Skel Club 1. Then we were approached by Laura to play the new Skel Club 2. What was the time lag here??

    Bruce: The first Skeleton Club closed Nov. 10, 1979, and the new one opened Dec. 7.

    >>Also soon after we were playing Spirit, Zebra Club, NPLC….when did these appear??

    Spirit opened in 1975, IIRC …

    The earliest show I have handy for the Zebra is May 16, 1979 (Los Microwaves, the Crawdaddys, the Puppies) …

    The first North Park Lions Club gig I can lay hands to is Feb. 3, 1979 (The Alley Cats, Offenderz, the Standbys).

  124. Mikel Says:

    That North Park Lions Club date sounds right, although I really should know for sure, since we (I believe it was Tom Griswold, Mary Grundler, Gina Vanlue, Richard Johnson and myself) were the first to book the club….

  125. Mikel Says:

    I wrote too soon. I didn’t remember that Leslie Pollock and Marc Hoffman (Marc Rude) were involved.

  126. Bruce Injection Says:

    If I remember correctly, the Spirit sucked. The regulars just stared with their mouths open at our band and our friends that came out.

    I didn’t know Tom G. was booking any bands -- and we Lived together!

    And when is Bobby X going to come up again. We played a “private” show for him that I barely survived…shaaaaady!!!

  127. Mikel Says:

    Bruce: Tom G and I started booking Abbey Road the summer before, although in the end it was just me.

  128. Bruce Injection Says:

    Mikel..did we know each other?? I lived at Front Street with Garry Heff, Paris, Lou Skum,Tom Grizwold….played all the clubs mentioned.

  129. gary heffern Says:

    Mikel…didn’t one of the guys (I think named Mark?) from Mature adults go on to play with the Cramps for awhile or maybe ex members of the original cramps…and great to see you here.

  130. gary heffern Says:

    and I know this is not the right forum for this, but since Mikel is here
    Evie, has passed away a couple of days ago from a brain aneurism..i’m sure spelling is incorrect. For those of you who did not know her there were 3 women in the beginning of the whole scene tat were huge zero’s fans Jackie, Kittie, and Evie…amazing women who loved rock n’ roll. Griswold has a really nice obit on his FB with a picture of her….sorry I don;t have alot of time, so if you need to move this to the proper place feel free to do so, I just wanted Mikel to know.

  131. Mikel Says:

    Thanks, Gary. Tom gives a wonderful remembrance of the lovely Evie Bibo:

  132. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Tom gives a wonderful remembrance of the lovely Evie Bibo

    My condolences. (And yes, of course, this is a fine thread for this sad news.)

  133. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Mikel Toombs has contributed some amazing stuff recently. (As have Jim Ryan and others … I’m panting to keep up.) Here’s one little sample from Mikel’s trove:

    “The Alley Cats at the opening of the original Skeleton Club (10/28/1979), photo by Tim Griswold”

  134. Mmrothenberg Says:

    PS: Was this Oct. 28 gig (which also included the Dinettes and Exterminators) really the first at the 4th Ave. location? (It’s indeed also the earliest for which I have a record.) If so, the original Skeleton Club lasted barely a month before the move to Market St.!

  135. Bruce Injection Says:

    IF this is the 10/28 gig, Lou Skum and I were there dressed as clockwork orange. Drunk and obnoxious….

  136. gary heffern Says:

    I see Peter NY there!

  137. Ray Brandes Says:

    I’m pretty sure that’s Mark Z in the middle of the crowd.

  138. Mmrothenberg Says:

    OK, so far no one has contradicted that the original Skeleton Club opened Oct. 28, 1979, with the Alley Cats and was shut down Nov. 10 with the Dead Kennedys

    The original club lasted two weeks?? Dang! Actual patrons of that venue probably represent a smaller number than actual passengers on the Mayflower.

  139. Peggy Sue Says:

    Yes that’s Peter New York -- theres also a bit of Sheri, Susan Stoup Me of course with the bloody overalls and the Pentax K1000, Mark Z Lydia, John Stoup. I think members of Mature Adults as well. It was a great night -- I have loads of photos from there -- but they are all stored at my mom’s in SD -- I’ll have to get a collection together next time I’m visiting her and post them. I’ve got a great archive…

  140. Joe Piper Says:

    Hi Peggy! I’d know those overalls anywhere!

  141. Bruce Injection Says:

    You’ll notice the crowd is still sans punk attire at this point!!

    I do see some blue jeans, nice sweaters, and skinny ties a la Huey Lewis though!!

    Peter NY, front left, is probably the most fashionable dresser at this time!!

  142. Mmrothenberg Says:

    From Mikel Toombs:

    The Dils at the original Skeleton Club 11/4/1979 (photo by Tim Griswold):

  143. Mmrothenberg Says:

    From Mikel Toombs:

    Peter English at the Skeleton Club (1/28/80), photo by Peggy Sue Amison (Injections/Upbeats/Peter English/Non/Unknowns)

  144. Mikel Says:

    Bruce: It might have been that show. But you’re thinking of Boyd Rice. The roto-guitar!

  145. Dave Doyle Says:

    A bit late back into this thread, but in the DK photo posted by Mikel, I believe I spy myself behind Floride’s amp as I posted prior I had been hanging out behind the back line.

  146. Bruce Injection Says:

    MIKEL -- It may have been Boyd with the guitar, but I think I remember Peter throwing the hot dogs at the audience????

    I mean…what’s better than throwing hot dogs at your audience….really……

  147. Dave Doyle Says:

    There is a Q-Sub review of said hot dog throwing incident somewhere, I must dig it up as i do recall the event but the details are lacking as I was not present.

  148. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Lydia Lunch of 8-Eyed Spy at the Skeleton Club (2/14/80), photo by Peggy Sue Amison (8-Eyed Spy/Mature Adults/Xterminators/Barbie & Ken [Laurie O’Connell & Boyd Rice]) (collection Mikel Toombs)

  149. Ray Brandes Says:

    Thank you Terry, Bruce, Mikel, etc. This is why I love this blog so much.

  150. Mikel Says:

    Same show, Clayton again, this time on Non:

    The one-man Non [he had split with Robert Turman], Boyd Rice, performed one composition which lasted about 15 minutes. It was simply a matter of letting his synthesizer produce pure noise resembling a machine shop’s while Boyd threw raw but thawed wieners at the crowd, which was submerged in darkness. Rice had a flashlight which made it all a bit unfair, considering there were plenty of those in the [crowd] who desired to and did heave the hot dogs back at him. Strange pursuit from one who I understand likes Abba.

  151. gary heffern Says:

    THIS is where it gets interesting…

  152. gary heffern Says:

    Kris Kristofferson —Nobody Wins

    Any more it doesn’t matter
    Who’s right or wrong
    We’ve been injuring each other
    For much too long
    And it’s too late to try to save
    What might have been
    It’s over
    Nobody wins
    Make believin in forever
    Is just a lie
    And it seems a little sadder
    Each time we try
    ‘Cause it’s a shame to make
    The same mistakes again
    And again
    It’s over.
    Nobody wins
    We’ve gone too far too long
    Too far apart
    The lovin’ was easy
    It’s the livin’ that’s hard
    And there’s no need to stay and see
    The way it ends
    It’s over.
    Nobody wins

  153. gary heffern Says:

    And yes, thank you Terry Marine, I didn’t want to say anything but that is Peter New York in that picture. Most times I saw him he had a black eye or an injury…because most folks wouldn’t give him a chance…the guy was pure art…and got beaten up by fellow “punks”. When I went to Buddy Blue’s funeral all these people kept asking me if I was going to go up and say something about him…I didn’t because the only thing I could think of the whole time I was there was “I don’t think I ever saw him without a black eye.” Try all you can but you can’t re-write the past…it’s already been written. Humbleness goes along way.

  154. Bruce Injection Says:

    Oh Yeah….love this thread!! So glad we cleared up the wienie throwing….would swear to this day it was Peter NY…must have been a little high!!!!

    Needless to say….great show!!! FONO saves us again!!!

  155. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>”I never really saw the hot-dogs.”

    This is sounding a little like Dallas, Nov. 22, 1963. Were there two hot-dog flingers?

  156. joey miller Says:

    jesh who could forget the hotdogs? That was so amazing.I think I stood in one spot with my my eyes glued watching the stage all night.

    The reviews we use to get. I liked dan maclains the best back in the day.

    we were a cross between creedence clearwater revival and someone else ( cant remember off the top of my head) in his mind. :) I remember the reference to CCR because I had fond memories of them.

  157. Bruce Injection Says:

    I SAW the hot dog throwing….a single shooter to be sure MATT!!!

    Which brings up another question -- was it the Mentors or the Urinals that pissed all over their equipment at the end of their set…and was this, possibly, at Blackies 1979-80??

  158. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>was it the Mentors or the Urinals that pissed all over their equipment at the end of their set…and was this, possibly, at Blackies 1979-80??

    Bruce: Where was Blackie’s?

  159. Bruce Injection Says:

    Blackies was in LA, or near LA. Injections played there with the Mentors or the Urinals…can’t remember. I DO remember that Lou broke the mics and sang “unplugged”….with a loud punk band…awesome!!

    We also played at the Cuckoos Nest, somewhere up there, which was cool…the stage was so high that fans couldn’t spit on you or hit you with beer bottles!!!

  160. Bruce Injection Says:

    Hey ERIC -- read the above thread. All the details of the NON/Injections night, January 28, 1980.

  161. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Hey ERIC

    The Half-a-Bee??

  162. Bruce Injection Says:

    The Half-a-Bee?? Que Pasa???

  163. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>The Half-a-Bee?? Que Pasa???

    Eric the Half-a-Bee … Old Monty Python routine — who’s Eric?

  164. Bruce Injection Says:

    Oooohh!! Hey, you’re not THAT old!! That’s from when I was a kid.

    I’m hoping Eric Riffe is reading this stuff as he had some questions on Facebook re: weiner throwing night…might make it into his movie!!

  165. Tom G Says:

    Bruce, The guy on the back porch in the Front St/Injections photo is, more than likely, John Stoup. I don’t remember seeing Klowden there much, if at all, but John (and his buddy Carl Rusk) were regulars. Remember? They were about 15 at the time.

  166. Bruce Injection Says:

    Thanks for clarifying TOM! I think a lot of these threads need a little historical updating if you have LOADS of extra time….lots of information/mis-information.

    Why were these 15 year olds hanging out with us killers??

  167. Joe Piper Says:

    Unused ticket from my collection.

    I second the John Stoup ID.

  168. Bruce Injection Says:

    DAMN!! Injections, Crowd, Subhumans, (from Vancouver?)

    No date?? as always back then. $3. LOL

    Should I know John Stoup??

  169. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>DAMN!! Injections, Crowd, Subhumans, (from Vancouver?)
    >>No date?? as always back then. $3. LOL

    Bruce: This show happened Friday, Dec. 21, 1979, per the San Diego Concert Archive.

  170. Bruce Injection Says:

    Thanks oh Che Master!! Why was nothing dated back then??…no concept of posterity??

    Hope you’re well…I’m making and re-connecting with lots of friends thanks to CHE.

    Your humble poster

  171. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Should I know John Stoup??

    Bruce: He was one of the 15-year-olds Tom said was a regular at the Front St. house …

  172. Ray Brandes Says:

    John is also Sue Stoup’s younger brother. Sue used to have parties at which the Crawdaddys, Evasions, etc. would play. Carl was 12-13 (!!) at the time he hung out at the Front St. house. I met him when he was 14 and he introduced me to Paris, etc.

  173. Mmrothenberg Says:

    >>Carl was 12-13 (!!) at the time he hung out at the Front St. house. I met him when he was 14 and he introduced me to Paris, etc.

    Ray: I’m contemplating a post on local prodigies … There’s a list of precocious kids who were already fixtures by 11 to 13 — Carl Ruskl, “Little Sergio” Castillo and that Skullbusters singer are three who spring to mind immediately.

  174. Ray Brandes Says:

    Dave Klowden was also hanging out at a young age, as was (later on) Sean McMullen, Simon, Matt Johnson, Dirk, etc.

    I attribute this in part to youngish, unconventional parents. My father was a WWII D-Day veteran. There is NO WAY I would have been let out of the house to hang out at shows and parties at that age!

  175. gary heffern Says:

    both john and sue were unforgettable..you know these guys were LIVING rock and roll when other kids their same age were just dreaming about it.i remember john always in the same spot…right at the basement door whenever the crawdaddys rehearsed…I actually thought he would end up in the band at some point. that house was cursed and there was an evil presence that loomed.

  176. Bruce Injection Says:

    Front Street Gary??

  177. gary heffern Says:


  178. Bruce Injection Says:

    I don’t recall an evil presence at Front Street…other than us F*ckn’
    Punk rock maniacs!!

  179. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Skeleton Club’s condos now …

  180. Lou Skum Says:

    and we couldn’t get a dance license there

  181. JAS Says:

    May 1 1980, San Diego Reader: Confrontations between the police and the patrons of the Skeleton Club, a new-wave music venue located in what was formerly the Climax Ltd. Discotheque, have escalated to such a degree that the club may close its doors permanently. At least six arrests and dozens of misdemeanor citations have marred the weekly concerts since the club opened in its present location last December…


  182. Brian Thoryk Says:

    This is Brian Thoryk the guitarist for the Skullbusters back in the day. Fairmont Hall, Lyon’s Club, Kings Road Cafe and Adams Avenue Theater rocked the greatest shows of all-time. Just put out a comedy video on Hipsters that also pays serious homage to all the greatest punk bands from the 70’s and early 80’s. Check it out on YouTube “Hipster The Get Down”

  183. Mmrothenberg Says:

    Brian: Hilarious and evocative! Congratulations (and welcome).

Leave a Reply